[LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

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Xnout!
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby Xnout! » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:54 pm

Smiley expansion,
If you find one, say, on Google Images, you can just click on view image and post to your post.
No need for a personalized image hosting site if that's undesirable. :wink:

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XnTriq
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby XnTriq » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:15 am

Xnout! wrote:Smiley expansion,
If you find one, say, on Google Images, you can just click on view image and post to your post.
No need for a personalized image hosting site if that's undesirable. :wink:

Image That's exactly what I did. (I gotta admit that it's not my Photobucket account.)

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:47 pm

bdragon wrote:For example: Why, even after telling XnView not to check for updates it kept hanging because it could not "properly" (for whatever meaning of "proper" we might use here) access internet?


So yesterday night Windows updated.

No networks drivers were touched.

Lo and behold. XnView started hanging again.

And yes. The "Voodoo solution" still works. To a point.

As far as i can tell network drivers were not, in fact, touched.

Will try and reinstall them again.

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XnTriq
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby XnTriq » Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:30 am

bdragon wrote:Lo and behold. XnView started hanging again.

Could this be related to your firewall?

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 17, 2017 6:08 am

Uhm... that could indeed be a possibility... i do have a very stringent firewall... i'll check it out.

Though... knowing windows...

It's probably the fact that now you cannot disable anymore windows defender and windows firewall and that is what it is making problems.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:08 am

wait...
something i just thought...

When you say "QTR" are you talking about some sort of "quicktime runtime environment" or something along that line of thought? How do i disable it?

It might be that as i run custom codecs for work and last time i updated them the 21st of april, which was around time when i started complaining i think...

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XnTriq
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby XnTriq » Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:00 pm

bdragon wrote:Uhm... that could indeed be a possibility... i do have a very stringent firewall... i'll check it out.

In order to “harden” my system, I set up my firewall in a way that allows me to grant access “per application“. Even some services can't connect to the network, and IE is in “Work Offline” mode. So far, it's been smooth sailing, except for one thing: Installation of certain software pauses for a moment, depending on the installer's time-out value.

bdragon wrote:When you say "QTR" are you talking about some sort of "quicktime runtime environment" or something along that line of thought?

It has nothing to do with Apple's QuickTime. Please check out the links I provided:

XnTriq wrote:XnView MP (and XnConvert) use the Qt cross-platform framework. Qt-based applications seem to rely on the “Qt Network” module (Qt5Network.dll) for accessing the interwebs. Some Qt components have/had their own registry entries, …

XnTriq (XnView and XnViewMP .zip versions portable?) wrote:
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Trolltech
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\QtProject
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\kde.org\libphonon

… so I wouldn't be surprised if there are also references to them in the Windows Application Compatibility cache.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:47 pm

XnTriq wrote:
bdragon wrote:Uhm... that could indeed be a possibility... i do have a very stringent firewall... i'll check it out.

In order to “harden” my system, I set up my firewall in a way that allows me to grant access “per application“. Even some services can't connect to the network, and IE is in “Work Offline” mode. So far, it's been smooth sailing, except for one thing: Installation of certain software pauses for a moment, depending on the installer's time-out value.

That's more or less what i had to do for work, but i've been feeding slowly some software developers or producers to the "whitelist" as well as the "updaters whitelist" so it should not be this problematic... but yes... stuff like that seems to happen. Problem is. that in order to test this i would have to remove the firewall and either reset everything and then reinstall it, or to be actually really sure... remove the firewall and also run the computer without a firewall for some time. And due to my work... i am feeling uneasy to do that.

XnTriq wrote:
bdragon wrote:When you say "QTR" are you talking about some sort of "quicktime runtime environment" or something along that line of thought?

It has nothing to do with Apple's QuickTime. Please check out the links I provided:

XnTriq wrote:XnView MP (and XnConvert) use the Qt cross-platform framework. Qt-based applications seem to rely on the “Qt Network” module (Qt5Network.dll) for accessing the interwebs. Some Qt components have/had their own registry entries, …

XnTriq (XnView and XnViewMP .zip versions portable?) wrote:
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Trolltech
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\QtProject
  • HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\kde.org\libphonon

… so I wouldn't be surprised if there are also references to them in the Windows Application Compatibility cache.

eh... i'm out of this kind of programming, as basically i've been searching for scriptable programs and feeding them scripts for the last 10 years, i'm more of a user than a programmer anymore if scripts, batches and php can still be considered "programming" in some way or another. Problem is that when you have to work either you become a genius and do everything by yourself, exposing yourself to all kinds of problems due to your own incompetence, or you buy and take free stuff on the net... but then you live in a limbo not knowing what is wrong at any time. SInce i'm no genius i chose the second. So i'm one of those people that has to check everything after an update to see if it still works.

And also does some stupid things from time to time. Because, as i said i'm no genius.

Ah, well... it's annoying but i can live with that.

So... i did a few things:
- The changelog on my computer for the internet security/antivirus i use (COMODO if it is of any help) shows that it has changed within the last 3 days. Most files touched were the virus database but there has been at least a major update the night i said that windows updated. So yes in a single night both windows and comodo updated. This seldomly goes well. I'll probably have to uninstall comodo and reinstall it properly. As i said i am not fine with running without a firewall, but reinstalling should not be much of a problem for a test.
- Windows has no changelog because i soon found out with windows 10 that "therein lies madness" if you try and keep a log of what gets changed. Unluckily microsoft never tells us ever what the [BEEP] it's doing. And i refuse to use linux because i know myself and i'd try and tweak every code to my liking... again "therein lied madness"... plus most of the stuff i use for work would have to be run in wine, which means... well again: "therein lied madness". But it did do "something" that day and i had to run the usual script of ".reg corrections" that i usually run for "aesthetic purposes". Stuff like removing the complimentary folders on "my computer" or removing every whatsoever mention of "libraries" concerning the file explorer, and no, i'm not talking about DLLs... you know which "libraries" i'm talking about. Plus also removing Cortana because whomever thought that i would want to search the internet for stuff that is in my computer and then proceed to remove any option telling cortana NOT to search on the internet should be fired. I still keep search and i still keep the indexing, but cortana has to die.

ehm... sorry for the rant...

So... today i have some free time to dedicate myself to checking again why i can't read my comics at completely random intervals and i have to use "voodoo solutions" to get to read them.

So i'll just proceed to remove the wireless drivers, then the firewall... clean everything... then reinstall drivers then reinstall firewall. In this order.

I hope this ends. But really. Since last update Chrome has stopped giving me any kind of problems and i could reinstall all the extensions i had disabled. So it's just your software.

I hope the programmer'd consider providing a tool for removing all registry keys and/or rebuilding them or something like that.

Yes, i know. I'm an idiot for asking something that "therein lies madness" out of free software. *sigh* And yes... rebuilding something that you did not even write as you're using what is essentially an interface to windows is basically a really big pain in the ass. Nah, forget it, i'll check it later.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 17, 2017 6:10 pm

Okay.

Microsoft has definitively gone over the line.

You know the update i was referring to?

It is not marked as a driver update. But it is a driver update.

- I uninstall the driver.
Windows driver version becomes the "cannot uninstall" standard one for that driver.
- I install the driver i have.
Windows driver version becomes a new one.
- i proceed to install other things (comodo)
Windows warns me windows update has made an update.
- i check the update.
It is not marked as a driver update, but as a "Security fix".
- i check the network driver
Windows driver version has become an even newer one.

Yes, that happens even after i expressly told windows update to NOT mess with my drivers. I have a laptop and driver updates should be done with the manufacturer's (for the vast majority of them at least... i can understand a few components updates, such as the video card, since the manufacturer allows them expressly).

Except that it install a version of drivers which is incompatible with my PC. Now, this incompatibility is "minor", and it messes with 2 things in total: your program (i think), but also the driver's companion suite which i normally don't use, since it's just for limiting bandwidth... and... well... i usually have the opposite problem.

So yeah. I'm installing a different version of the driver's companion suite. Which is compatible with the newer driver. It should not make difference with your program, but i'll check in the following days.

Still installing drivers against one's will and without a way to stop them is a really bad practice.

But yes... understanding also why your program is basically the only one to give me problem might be something to investigate.

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XnTriq
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby XnTriq » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:30 pm

bdragon wrote:Problem is. that in order to test this i would have to remove the firewall and either reset everything and then reinstall it, or to be actually really sure... remove the firewall and also run the computer without a firewall for some time. And due to my work... i am feeling uneasy to do that.

:shock: I'm not suggesting to turn off your firewall. I was just wondering if it interfered with XnView. (Unfortunately I don't have any hands-on experience with Comodo's products.)

bdragon wrote:Windows has no changelog because i soon found out with windows 10 that "therein lies madness" if you try and keep a log of what gets changed. Unluckily microsoft never tells us ever what the [BEEP] it's doing.

I know too well what you mean. I'm still looking for the perfect system rollback solution.

bdragon wrote:But yes... understanding also why your program is basically the only one to give me problem might be something to investigate.

Could you please tell us the Knowledge Base and/or Security Bulletin number of the update you're referring to?

BTW: I mentioned the Qt framework, because issues in Qt-based programs sometimes stem from (and can be traced back to) bugs in Qt.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sun Jun 18, 2017 12:30 am

XnTriq wrote:
bdragon wrote:But yes... understanding also why your program is basically the only one to give me problem might be something to investigate.

Could you please tell us the Knowledge Base and/or Security Bulletin number of the update you're referring to?


The only update that got installed after each time i rolled back my network driver is this: KB4022725 which indeed says it has partially to do with networking stuff. And i suppose in my system it also updates the network driver for some reasons concerning the various stuff it says.

I understand that in order to get stuff working and to patch security you need to get a proper driver. I just wish it would warn me of that because drivers aren't "JUST" drivers anymore, there's lots of stuff that gets sideloaded along with the driver. In my case the new stuff that gets sideloaded is incompatible with the old stuff. So Windows pushed the driver update. And the driver itself updated, but the other stuff did not as it is by design made not to install itself with the old stuff i had. So i had a driver which was not designed with the support software for the driver itself.

I haven't had time yet to test if something is going to go wrong. But if the companion suite conflict is what was making the mess, well... both the driver company and microsoft are to blame. Microsoft for forcing a driver which is incompatible with the rest of the infrastructure and ramming it where it does not belong, and the driver company for making a driver which needs the companion suite to work properly but also stopping the companion suite to update to the new version when the old version is present.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:26 am

Ok, so now it's personal.

It worked for how long? 7 whole days... and now it does hang each time.

It's still network related.

But, strangely enough i found a "vodoo solution" to make it work.

Every.

Single.

Time.

No more messing around at random.

And this "vodoo solution" is simply... "start chrome". Or "close and restart chrome" if chrome was already running in the background.

if chrome is running XnView has no problems running. If chrome is not running, then XnView starts right about 2/3 of the times. But if for any whatsoever reason (that i now really want to understand) it starts hanging, then it won't run until i kill it and start chrome, then i restart XnView.

For whatever reason a very identical thing has now started happening with the Whatsapp desktop program. (not app)

This is so annoying.

Now i really want to understand why this is happening.

NOTE: It's probably going to need a system reinstall, but aside from the full day of reinstall needed to get all the programs back, as i can't really use a past image, since i already did it and it already had the problem (i just had not realized it)... i don't want to use a crack for half the programs i need for work while i wait for the usual 2 weeks needed to re-initialize the keys as it happened every time i even change a single component in my PC. Sure, last time i reinstalled the OS was about... 1 year and six months ago... policies might have changed. But somehow i think not. And sure enough, being annoyed for work is much worse than being annoyed for not being able to read some comics. :( So i really want to understand why before i do a scrap and reinstall.

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:30 am

Dammit, my copy of Detour is too old. It does not work with current systems. Or... well... it does work, it just does not show anything unless the app is 32 bits...

bdragon
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby bdragon » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:11 am

I've got to get out for work, i cannot do much more right now. However i've attached (for whatever is worth) a copy of the handles and the DLLS called when it is working and when it has crashed, since i can now reliably start it after it crashes.

i should get some better debug tools but for now this will have to do :(
Attachments
Downloads.zip
tab delimited CSV and also ODS format
(23.56 KiB) Downloaded 5 times

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XnTriq
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Re: [LONG] XnView Bug or not? Help to find a problem source.

Postby XnTriq » Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:45 pm

bdragon wrote:if chrome is running XnView has no problems running. If chrome is not running, then XnView starts right about 2/3 of the times. But if for any whatsoever reason (that i now really want to understand) it starts hanging, then it won't run until i kill it and start chrome, then i restart XnView.

For whatever reason a very identical thing has now started happening with the Whatsapp desktop program. (not app)

WebKit is the common denominator in Google Chrome (Blink) and XnView MP (QtWebKit / QtWebEngine).
Perhaps there's a conflict with Qt5WebKitXn.dll or Qt5WebKitWidgetsXn.dll :-?

BTW: Is Chrome's GPU hardware acceleration turned on?

bdragon wrote:However i've attached (for whatever is worth) a copy of the handles and the DLLS called when it is working and when it has crashed, since i can now reliably start it after it crashes.

i should get some better debug tools but for now this will have to do :(


@Pierre: Is this info helpful?


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