Clearing all categories

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monitor
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Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:35 pm

Hi, I am somewhat new to XnViewMP - using 0.85 - and am wondering if there is a reasonably quick and convenient way to clear all all categories, or to avoid merging when loading a new categories file?
TIA

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helmut
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby helmut » Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:59 am

Thank you for registering to the XnView forum and your request, monitor. I'm not very familiar with categories and also wondered: Assigning categories is easy but removing all categories seems not supported. E.g. I would expect an entry "Category » Remove from all categories" in context menu.
I'm very nosey to read what categories experts like m.Th. reply.

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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby xnview » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:28 am

In category pane, you have 'Categories management>Clear all'
Pierre.

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m.Th.
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby m.Th. » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:31 am

What Pierre said.

However, the confirmation message should be clearer and use the word "Delete" and not "Clear" again...
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

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helmut
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby helmut » Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:11 am

xnview wrote:In category pane, you have 'Categories management>Clear all'
O.k.. I've seen that meny entry but didn't expect that this was the right menu to remove all categories from a file. To be honest I think the hidden location of the menu is no good. And the menu itself is pretty unclear and feels and looks wrong to me. An example: Why is it "Category management > Clear all" and not "File's categories > Clear all"?
Perhaps time to start a seperate topic and discussion...

monitor
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:26 pm

Thank you, Pierre.
I had missed that entry
My main interest was to make it easier for me to manage my categories - I was having trouble moving 'leafs' to the proper place.
However, one of the comments in this thread, made me sit up and take notice, because, it seems that 'Clear all" really does way more than I expected.
It not only clears the Categories' pane, it also removes all categories from all images I had already categorized :-( - not what I had had in mind.
Fortunately, I have only just started with this, so not much was lost.
But it then does not really help me accomplish what I had expected/wanted.

It raises another question for me: the assigned categories only stay in the database, they do not become part of the image metadata?

As I have been trying to add categories or move entries, I had to resort to various devious ways to get what I want. Perhaps I should record those things in a different topic on this forum?

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xnview
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby xnview » Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:00 am

monitor wrote:It not only clears the Categories' pane, it also removes all categories from all images I had already categorized :-( - not what I had had in mind.
Fortunately, I have only just started with this, so not much was lost.
But it then does not really help me accomplish what I had expected/wanted.

It raises another question for me: the assigned categories only stay in the database, they do not become part of the image metadata?

Do you use Catalog only, or write categories in metadata (Settings>Metadata>Write...)??
Pierre.

monitor
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:13 pm

xnview wrote:
monitor wrote:It raises another question for me: the assigned categories only stay in the database, they do not become part of the image metadata?

Do you use Catalog only, or write categories in metadata (Settings>Metadata>Write...)??

I have 'Export DB Category to XMP ...' checked now, because I do want to export to the image.
My main purpose is to use XnViewMP as a metadata editor because I want to record as much of this information as part of the image and make it available for searching.
When does the write to the image take place? When I move to a new image or when I close down the app?

I have been working with both the 'catalog filter' pane as well as the 'categories' pane and I find that one can do things in one, but not the other for obvious reasons, but it takes some time for a newb ;-).
The right-click menus differ and I am slowly coming to see the differences and the different conditions for either.
Also I am finding that some of the things, like moving leafs in the tree, can be done, though perhaps not in the most obvious way, by dragging and dropping
One thing I would really find useful, if after adding a leaf in the categories pane, that leaf were placed according to its place in alpha order, rather than always at the end, where I then have to move it to its proper place manually.

Right now, I am using categories for the names of people in the image, though I'd appreciate to get some feedback as to whether categories or keywords would be the better, more appropriate place and why, i.e field size limits etc.

Another related question: where can I find a mapping of XnViewMP fields and the corresponding metadata field?
TIA

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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby xnview » Mon Apr 10, 2017 8:27 am

monitor wrote:When does the write to the image take place? When I move to a new image or when I close down the app?

As soon as you change the selection

Another related question: where can I find a mapping of XnViewMP fields and the corresponding metadata field?

In XMP metadata:
Categories => dc:subject
Rating => xmp:rating
Color label => xmp:Label
Comment => dc:comment & exif:UserComment
Pierre.

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m.Th.
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby m.Th. » Mon Apr 10, 2017 12:11 pm

I have been working with both the 'catalog filter' pane as well as the 'categories' pane and I find that one can do things in one, but not the other for obvious reasons, but it takes some time for a newb ;-).


Their unification is one of the top priorities

Also I am finding that some of the things, like moving leafs in the tree, can be done, though perhaps not in the most obvious way, by dragging and dropping


Drag & drop should work. What problems do you have?

Right now, I am using categories for the names of people in the image, though I'd appreciate to get some feedback as to whether categories or keywords would be the better, more appropriate place and why, i.e field size limits etc.


Categories for the „Who” (people) is the recommended way to go. Same stands for „Where” (places) and „When” (events).

For the „Who” you should write the names starting with surname (eg. „Gougelet Pierre”) and depending on your internal conventions, titles could be at end („du Plessis Andre, FRPS”) - preferable - or at the beginning („Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew”) or both („Prince William, Duke of Cambridge, KG, KT, PC, ADC(P)”).

If applicable, you can group them in categories of people - this will help when you will search by expanding the tree, will help in filtering and, also, will help when you do not know who is photographed but you know the social group, status etc. on which you can assign it („military personnel”, „clergy” etc.)
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

monitor
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:22 pm

xnview wrote:
monitor wrote:When does the write to the image take place? When I move to a new image or when I close down the app?

As soon as you change the selection

Another related question: where can I find a mapping of XnViewMP fields and the corresponding metadata field?

In XMP metadata:
Categories => dc:subject
Rating => xmp:rating
Color label => xmp:Label
Comment => dc:comment & exif:UserComment

Thank you very much, Pierre

monitor
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:29 pm

m.Th. wrote:
Also I am finding that some of the things, like moving leafs in the tree, can be done, though perhaps not in the most obvious way, by dragging and dropping


Drag & drop should work. What problems do you have?

The main problem I have found so far is when I try to order the leafs in branch at the same level.
Dragging a leaf with the mouse until I get a single line between the two leaves at the new position, puts the moved leaf as a child of the first of the two, rather than between the intended leaves.
m.Th. wrote:
Right now, I am using categories for the names of people in the image, though I'd appreciate to get some feedback as to whether categories or keywords would be the better, more appropriate place and why, i.e field size limits etc.


Categories for the „Who” (people) is the recommended way to go. Same stands for „Where” (places) and „When” (events).

For the „Who” you should write the names starting with surname (eg. „Gougelet Pierre”) and depending on your internal conventions, titles could be at end („du Plessis Andre, FRPS”) - preferable - or at the beginning („Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew”) or both („Prince William, Duke of Cambridge, KG, KT, PC, ADC(P)”).

If applicable, you can group them in categories of people - this will help when you will search by expanding the tree, will help in filtering and, also, will help when you do not know who is photographed but you know the social group, status etc. on which you can assign it („military personnel”, „clergy” etc.)

Thank you very much for this clarification. Those questions had been on my mind and using these locations had been more or less what I had thought to be the ideal places.
You must have read my mind, because my main use would be for genealogical work :D

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m.Th.
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby m.Th. » Tue Apr 11, 2017 5:12 am

The main problem I have found so far is when I try to order the leafs in branch at the same level.
Dragging a leaf with the mouse until I get a single line between the two leaves at the new position, puts the moved leaf as a child of the first of the two, rather than between the intended leaves.


Yes, you must get used with the fact that you must drag the category over the PARENT an not between the siblings. The program does not know where to place it (as a sibling or as a child) - IOW what are your intentions.

There are indeed some programs which try to solve this by looking at where you drag the category: if you drag on the category's checkbox then it is added as a sibling otherwise as a child but at least IMHO it is pretty confusing and annoying at times.



Unrelated hint: the best practice is to use your keyboard: F9 toggles the focus between Thumbs Pane and the Incremental Search box from Category pane where you can quickly find you category and assign it. Dig in the menu of the [...] button right next this box to see the available options (Search Modes, Actions etc.).
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

monitor
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby monitor » Thu Apr 13, 2017 4:59 pm

m.Th. wrote:Yes, you must get used with the fact that you must drag the category over the PARENT an not between the siblings. The program does not know where to place it (as a sibling or as a child) - IOW what are your intentions.

It seems to me, my intentions are clear to, at least, the built-in cursor, as it changes to show it knows what I might want to do as it changes to a line when I hover the moving entry between entries and back again if I am directly over another child.

Another thing which was also surprising is, that when I hover the item I want to move over the parent, the cursor overlay changes to include the red circle with a red line through it - the 'do not enter' sign - similar to what happens when I drag it back to its original position.
IMO, this red 'do not enter' sign really is not applicable/intuitive in either case ;-)
m.Th. wrote:There are indeed some programs which try to solve this by looking at where you drag the category: if you drag on the category's checkbox then it is added as a sibling otherwise as a child but at least IMHO it is pretty confusing and annoying at times.

Which program(s) are confusing? XnViewMP's way or the other programs?

FWIW, I'm used to other programs which do allow me to move items by dragging and moving items within a list to the place I wish them to be. This is exactly why I raised this issue :-)

m.Th. wrote:Unrelated hint: the best practice is to use your keyboard: F9 toggles the focus between Thumbs Pane and the Incremental Search box from Category pane where you can quickly find you category and assign it. Dig in the menu of the [...] button right next this box to see the available options (Search Modes, Actions etc.).

Thank you; there are still a lot of things like that, that I have to find and remember ;-)

Xnout!
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Re: Clearing all categories

Postby Xnout! » Mon Jun 05, 2017 3:37 am

Fairly new to the game, and I've cleared the categories. Great.
But why are the yellow flags still on all the thumbnails after clearance? They don't seem to really do anything categorically
when I hover on or click on them.

What I don't understand is it seems intuitive when cats are cleared (downturned yellow flags) to have them removed.
Then, when you assign one a flag appears on the targeted thumbnail(s) to show it/they is/are categorized.

What am I not understanding about their omnipresence?

Update:
Nevermind. Apparently it was a refresh issue. I was in the show all folders/subfolders view when I cleared everything,
and they didn't remove, but when I went out and then back into view, they were gone. :D


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