Keyword vs Category

Ask for help and post your question on how to use XnView MP.

Moderators: XnTriq, xnview

User avatar
xnview
Author of XnView
Posts: 27350
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2003 7:31 am
Location: France
Contact:

Keyword vs Category

Postby xnview » Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:10 am

- "Keyword" > "Category"
In XnView you can assign categories to images. Formerly, these categories were named keywords. But now that we have "category sets", the term "keywords" does no longer make sense. I might be wrong, but atm think that all occurrences of "keyword" should be replaced with "category" (and "keywords" to "categories").


What do you think?
Pierre.

User avatar
m.Th.
XnThusiast
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:31 am
Contact:

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby m.Th. » Thu Jul 02, 2015 8:17 am

Sure it has to be the same therm everywhere.

Everyone else uses „keywords”

We use almost everywhere „categories”.

Do we loose users more than we gain if we change „categories” to „keywords”?
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

jadO
Posts: 260
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 6:36 am

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby jadO » Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:58 am

xnview wrote:
- "Keyword" > "Category"
In XnView you can assign categories to images. Formerly, these categories were named keywords. But now that we have "category sets", the term "keywords" does no longer make sense. I might be wrong, but atm think that all occurrences of "keyword" should be replaced with "category" (and "keywords" to "categories").


What do you think?


I think tags would the word that most user would use for that.

User avatar
m.Th.
XnThusiast
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:31 am
Contact:

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby m.Th. » Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:43 am

Tags is used more in web interfaces (Flickr etc.) whereas keywords in desktop ones (Lr, Zoner, ACDSee etc.)

Also, for us is a non-starter because we have the „Tag Box” and Tagged (selected) files. Another meaning.
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

jadO
Posts: 260
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 6:36 am

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby jadO » Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:22 am

m.Th. wrote:Tags is used more in web interfaces (Flickr etc.)

That´s why I believe for most user tags would be easiest approach.

dandv
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Nov 08, 2008 10:46 pm
Location: Silicon Valley
Contact:

Having both Keywords and Categories is unnecessarily complic

Postby dandv » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:31 pm

m.Th. wrote:Do we loose [sic] users more than we gain if we change „categories” to „keywords”?


You lose users by having unnecessary complexity. How many users genuinely need a difference between "categories" and "keywords"? I consider myself a power user (worked as a software eng. at Google and Yahoo!, have been using image management software since 1998, and have a keen attention to detail) but never needed this distinction. I also use the most powerful photo management app for Android (F-Spot) and its tagging capabilities are excellent while using only one concept, tags. F-Stop does use a database of tags, but only for performance. It stores the metadata within the images, to avoid lock-in. This is the best of both worlds.

My strong suggestion is to simplify tagging by unifying keywords and categories in the UI, and storing the same underlying metadata in all applicable formats (e.g. both XMP and IPTC). That will ensure compatibility with tools that support either format (e.g. the most popular image viewer on Windows, Irfan, only supports IPTC, while gThumb, F-Stop, Google's Snapseed and many others use XMP). It will also avoid the perplexing situation I'm illustrating in the screencast below (click it to see the animation).
Attachments
XnViewMP difference Keywords Categories.gif
Are Categories empty or not?

User avatar
xnview
Author of XnView
Posts: 27350
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2003 7:31 am
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Having both Keywords and Categories is unnecessarily com

Postby xnview » Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:30 pm

dandv wrote:My strong suggestion is to simplify tagging by unifying keywords and categories in the UI, and storing the same underlying metadata in all applicable formats (e.g. both XMP and IPTC). That will ensure compatibility with tools that support either format (e.g. the most popular image viewer on Windows, Irfan, only supports IPTC, while gThumb, F-Stop, Google's Snapseed and many others use XMP). It will also avoid the perplexing situation I'm illustrating in the screencast below (click it to see the animation).

Yes, the IPTC dialog is not usefull if you use XMP in XnViewMP because categories are written in keywords of IPTC, and subject of XMP. But some users need always to edit IPTC data only where we have keywords AND categories.
Pierre.

User avatar
m.Th.
XnThusiast
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:31 am
Contact:

Re: Having both Keywords and Categories is unnecessarily com

Postby m.Th. » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:35 pm

xnview wrote:
dandv wrote:My strong suggestion is to simplify tagging by unifying keywords and categories in the UI, and storing the same underlying metadata in all applicable formats (e.g. both XMP and IPTC). That will ensure compatibility with tools that support either format (e.g. the most popular image viewer on Windows, Irfan, only supports IPTC, while gThumb, F-Stop, Google's Snapseed and many others use XMP). It will also avoid the perplexing situation I'm illustrating in the screencast below (click it to see the animation).

Yes, the IPTC dialog is not usefull if you use XMP in XnViewMP because categories are written in keywords of IPTC, and subject of XMP. But some users need always to edit IPTC data only where we have keywords AND categories.


So it is a compatibility problem?
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

User avatar
m.Th.
XnThusiast
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:31 am
Contact:

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby m.Th. » Tue Jan 17, 2017 5:03 pm

My strong suggestion is to simplify tagging by unifying keywords and categories in the UI,...


If you look everywhere there is just a single engine - Categories. Categories Pane, Categories Sets pane. Keyboard Shortcuts for them, Right-Click menu et.

The only (unfortunate) case is in the IPTC window where the above engine is called „Keywords” and appears a new one called ...Categories which is unrelated to everything from above.

Frankly I don't know how many users use the IPTC window for tagging. Usually they use the above tools.
m. Th.

The Ascetic Experience - The best photos and texts from Holy Mountain (Athos)

- Dark Themed XnViewMP 0.86 64bit & XnView 2.00 x64 on Win7 x64 -

User avatar
Optic
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2017 3:19 am
Contact:

Re: Keyword vs Category

Postby Optic » Fri Jun 16, 2017 12:44 am

Hi there,

My thoughts as a new XNView MP user.

I think just using "Category" because it works well with "Category Sets"

"Keyword" to me is confusing and I don't use it - maybe only because my needs are simple. I am only using XnView MP for the tree categories and ratings, with basic folder structure and all my images are on an external HDD (which uses RAID 0 w/2 HDDs) via USB 3. I don't have any existing Lightroom catalog and/or have no need to do IPTC/EXIF/XMP metadata because my images are not camera photos, they're digital asset images, screenshots, renders, posters, etc.


Return to “MP - General Support”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest